file Frage Motor upgrade

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05 Nov 2017 20:00 #51066 von Cpt Wingnut
Motor upgrade wurde erstellt von Cpt Wingnut
Will the Stepcraft electroncs board supply enough ‘juice’ to power dual Nema 23s on the Y axis?
It looks possible to replace the belt drive with a dual direct drive system.
Maybe upgrade the X and Z motors too.

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07 Nov 2017 17:03 #51101 von Deltaflyer
Deltaflyer antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hi Cpt Wingnut,
definitely not! You have to decouple the control signals for the Y-axis and give it to 2 separate motor drivers. Or use a control software that can control the 4th axis as a Y slave. then you can use the 4th axle module as a driver for the 2nd Y engine. I think the Stepcraft control card (with modification) can not deliver much more than 2.2 A of string current.

Greeting Stefan

Mein Tag hat 24 Stunden und reicht dies mal nicht nehm ich noch die Nacht dazu.

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08 Nov 2017 17:35 #51127 von Cpt Wingnut
Cpt Wingnut antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hey Stefan,
Thanks for the reply.
I guessed there might be a power issue but the control of the motors is obviously more complicated than I thought.
Would the 2.2A be per axis?

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08 Nov 2017 18:04 #51129 von Deltaflyer
Deltaflyer antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Yes, per axle. But, the maximum current the card can deliver is 4A, as a soldered fuse only allows 4A. In addition, in the motor drivers resistors must be exchanged against others and the driver IC are provided with heat sinks.

I replaced the entire control board with the Planet3CM MK3-4 Controller ( www.planet-cnc.com ) and 5A Motor Driver.
I replaced the engines with 65Ncm Nema17. Power supply 50V / 13A.
In addition, a self-made interface 100% compatible with Stepcraft for Stepcraft accessories.

Greetings Stefan

Mein Tag hat 24 Stunden und reicht dies mal nicht nehm ich noch die Nacht dazu.

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09 Nov 2017 14:51 #51133 von Cpt Wingnut
Cpt Wingnut antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hi-ya,
It sounds like you’ve been busy.
These modifications you’ve made are on a Stepcraft machine?
If so, how does the belt drive system handle the ‘stronger’ Nema 17s?
Does your interface also control the on/off and speed of the spindle?

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09 Nov 2017 16:33 #51134 von Deltaflyer
Deltaflyer antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hi,
Yes, it was quite expensive. Has it taken a night or many more to develop the electronic interfaces, have pcb´s manufactured and equipped.
yes it is a Stepcraft SC2 / 840. The belt drive works perfectly. But I also modified the bearings in the front of the machine for the Y-spindles. Between these bearings, I have very precise distance rings to be able to adjust the bearing clearance absolutely clean, without burdening the bearings axially too much.
For the X-engine and the Z-engine, I installed an axial ball bearing between the engine and the axle connector.
The spindle is a 1.5 KW air cooled China spindle. And yes, this is controlled by the MK3 / 4 controller via a separate small interface for on / off and speed. The mk3 / 4 controller outputs a PWM signal, which is converted into a 0V - 10V signal in a PWM to Voltage Conwerter.
At the same time, I could have connected the fixed tool length sensor, the workpiece height sensor and the 3D sensor to the machine, as I installed separate conectors for this purpose.
With these modifications, my machine reaches a speed of 7000 mm / min on the X axis and the Z axis and 6500 mm / min on the y axis without step losses. Milled, of course, slows down.
The y-axis can not run faster just because the long thin Y-thread spindles begin to vibrate.
The entire electronics including power supply, voltage converter, motor drivers and interfaces, I have built into the Stepcraft. In addition, all axes are grounded all the way to the tool tip and at the same potential to avoid static discharge.

Greetings Stefan

Mein Tag hat 24 Stunden und reicht dies mal nicht nehm ich noch die Nacht dazu.

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12 Nov 2017 16:33 #51163 von Cpt Wingnut
Cpt Wingnut antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hi-ya,
Thank you very much for sharing all this.
Those are some pretty extensive modifications you’ve made.

I’d be very interested in copying the axial bearings you’ve installed.
Have you considered ball screws too?

I would also like to upgrade the motors but as I'm new to this the mods you’ve made to the electronics exceed my knowledge.
As the new ‘black edition’ has upgraded motors I think I’ll wait and see if the electronics will be available as spare parts.
With regards to the interfaces you made, were there no off-the-shelf alternatives?

Thanks again.

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14 Nov 2017 00:04 #51182 von Deltaflyer
Deltaflyer antwortete auf Motor upgrade
hi-ya,
Yes, because nut nuts must be exchanged and nut holders milled, this is not a big problem.
In addition, the manufacturer of spindles in Switzerland, just like me. Thus, I can easily get to the hardware ran.
That's why I've already converted to ball nuts.
I think it's good, if you look at the Black Edition in more detail, is certainly cheaper than the extensive conversion of mechanics and electronics, which I have made, in addition, my conversion was very, very time-consuming and also requires electronics and Mikrocontroler experience, as well experience in the installation of mechanical systems.
I have neither a mechanic, nor an electronics engineer nor an engineering education. I also have no training in computer engineering or programming. Most of the time I learned self-taught. For 44 years I've been building models as a hobby, electronics for 40 years, and since about 32 years
Computers are also my hobby. 13 years ago, microcontroller was added. lately I am very concerned with Arduino, and electro RC cars that are upwards of 80 km / h + upwards.
My fastest rc electric buggy (1/10) drives 136.4 km / h (measured)
drives with 3S Lipo (11.1V / 220A continuous - 400A pulse at full acceleration)
Required from 0km / h to 136km / h about 2.5 seconds (on road)
Of course, this buggy is heavily modified by me because the powertrain is not originally designed for such performance.

Sorry my english is only a google translation, because i speak almost no english. Although I can read instructions in English and understand analogously, but with the gramatik I'm not clear. Unfortunately, languages are not my thing, I have always had learning problems with languages.

Greetings Stefan

Mein Tag hat 24 Stunden und reicht dies mal nicht nehm ich noch die Nacht dazu.

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15 Nov 2017 21:38 #51210 von Cpt Wingnut
Cpt Wingnut antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hey Stefan,
I appreciate your taking the time to answer my questions.
Did you change the lead screws too or keep the Stepcraft ones?
Can I ask what make and model ball nuts you used?

Many, many years ago I used to run modified 3.5cc 1/8 off-road nitro cars. These would run on a mix of 60% methanol, 25% nitro methane and 15% castor/synthetic oil.
They would often reach speeds of 110 – 130kph.

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16 Nov 2017 09:49 - 16 Nov 2017 09:50 #51214 von Deltaflyer
Deltaflyer antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hi Cpt Wingnut,
No, the Stepcraft lead screws are manufactured by the swiss company 'Eichenberger'. There are different spindle nuts for these lead screws, as well as ball nuts. Therefore, the lead screws can still be used if they are still flawless. I made the conversion within the first 15 hours of operation of my Steppi.

Yes, with the Nitro cars high speeds are possible, unfortunately you can hardly drive these anywhere in Switzerland, except for races and in RC Car Clubs.
But just for fun on a large parking lot or something, it does not work, it makes you angry because of noise pollution.
That's why I only drive electric cars. Size 1/10, 1/8 and 1/5.
I own a Doge Viper, is a conversion from Nitro to Elektro. Runs with 4S Lipo, has about 3.5HP and also reaches 140km / h (measured).
What fascinates me about Elektro is the extremely high acceleration that is achieved and that I am allowed to drive at any time and anywhere without receiving any complaints.
But I remember, in my youth you could go with the Nitro almost everywhere.

Greetings Stefan

Mein Tag hat 24 Stunden und reicht dies mal nicht nehm ich noch die Nacht dazu.
Letzte Änderung: 16 Nov 2017 09:50 von Deltaflyer.

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16 Nov 2017 11:59 #51215 von peterg1000
peterg1000 antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hi Stefan,

Very interested to hear you have upgraded your machine to use Eichenberger ballscrews whilst using the original leadscrews. I tried some time ago with ballnuts from a different manufacturer - unfortunately an expensive mistake!!

Do you by any chance have the part number of the Eichenberger ballnut - I might have another go now you have proven that they work on an SC2 series machine

Thanks,

Peter

SC 420/2, Industrial VFD spindle from StoneyCNC
UC100 + UCCNC
Cut2D, Autosketch10, Draftsight, Eagle 9.5.1


There is no problem, however simple, that cannot be made more complicated by thinking about it.

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17 Nov 2017 16:34 #51253 von Cpt Wingnut
Cpt Wingnut antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hey Stefan,
I would very much like to try the ball nut upgrade.
Did you convert all 3 axes or just the Y axis?
I think in a previous post you mentioned that you had a local company machine the brackets for you, is that right?
As peterg1000 is also interested could you have a look for the part number please?

I see FaFiNoS has posted his conversion, looks good too.

I used to run my nitros in the street too, luckily I didn’t receive any complaints.
The downside to glow engine cars is the mess and the fuel is not very healthy either.
Now I’ve got the Stepcraft I might dust off the old buggies and convert to electric.

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25 Jan 2018 04:53 #52332 von nesaguilar78@gmail.com
nesaguilar78@gmail.com antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hi Stefan,

Could you explain what resistors need to be exchanged against each other to get more current to the motors? I was considering upgrading the y axis motor and probably x as well. I will also add the heat sinks as you advised if I decide to go this route.

Thanks in advance.

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03 Mär 2018 17:03 #53075 von Vag
Vag antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Hello Everyone,

I'm also experiencing some Y axis problems with my SC2/600.

After hours of trying to tune it (following the videos provided by Stepcraft etc...) it still looses steps and I have the impression that it lacks of power.
This is probably the reason why the black edition is now proposed with more powerful motors.

Is there any possibility to use a more powerful motor, instead of the underpowered stock one from Stepcraft, without having to replace the whole board of electronics?

Thank you in advance, for your help

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08 Mai 2018 23:19 #53724 von bmartens
bmartens antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Vag,
You seem to be in the wrong thread here.
Look at the StoneyCNC videos on adjusting/tuning your X and Y axis (Youtube), and follow those. They seem to work quite well for many (including myself)

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17 Mai 2018 11:05 #53770 von Songi
Songi antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Was wars am Ende?

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19 Mai 2018 06:15 #53783 von Vag
Vag antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Thank you for the suggestion bmartens,
These videos were exactly the ones I followed, in order to tune my SC2/600, after having tried the instructions from Stepcraft.
Actually for instance, I only can achieve a speed of 1mm/s when cutting carbon sheets having 2mm of thickness, in one pass.
And this speed, I was able to reach it after having removed the grease delivered from SC, replacing it with a thinner lubricant (WD40/PTFE).
I think that speed could be better than 1mm/s on this machine.

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25 Sep 2018 16:20 #54718 von skynet
skynet antwortete auf Motor upgrade
I'm in the process of trying to convert my SC2/840 to dual Y stepper motors. I have designed a new controller with an extra driver for the second Y axis motor. I have also included my current configuration, with the parallel and 4th axis modules integrated.

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I have tested it and so far so good, now I will have to order some parts to get the mechanical side of things ready.

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20 Nov 2018 22:36 #55186 von msquared
msquared antwortete auf Motor upgrade
In this thread, you've mentioned that the control card is too underpowered to control two NEMA 23 steppers, but would it be powerful enough to control two of the stock NEMA 17s (the 1.8A Nanotec motors)?

Failing that, is there any way to take the existing output from the y-axis controller and amplify it so that the current will be sufficient to power two motors?

Ideally, i'd like to directly drive the two y-axis lead screws with stepper motors without having to replace the entire unit controller (since the motor controllers are ingrained in the unit control PCB).

thanks

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21 Nov 2018 08:33 #55190 von skynet
skynet antwortete auf Motor upgrade
Answer is no. The good news is that since I published my mod, Stepcraft got in touch and they will release an upgrade pack with a new control unit and all the parts needed to have the two y-axis motors.

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